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OnTheFly
Well-known member
Thuggin4Life said:
Every time you crack a beer.
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Cops on the water?
Every time you crack a beer.
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xltom
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Broken Rod,
I can agree with what your saying EXCEPT you leave no room for the fact that being a cop doesn't always make you right or a great person. Case in point: I got pulled over in a tourist town in florida for blowing a stop sign. It was obstructed by some bushes. The cop knew it was obstructed and instead of having someone cut back the bushes, he sat there and issued tickets for who knows how long. He issued so many tickets at that stop sign that eventually a judge caught on and my ticket was dropped. And let's not forget the harrisburg police who issued so many tickets on the 5 that they were eventually told not to set traps there anymore. Small town departments get revenue from stuff like that.
There are a lot of good cops out there, but how can you say that there aren't any bad ones? Remember the Eugene cop who was convicted of multiple counts of rape a few years back? I agree that most people who get tickets feel they were not at fault. In this case, the officer is notorious, so much so that you know who Andy is talking about already. Some cops sign on to actually help people, but a few are all about having power over other people........because nobody liked them in high school...
Like I said I can agree with you for the most part, but cops are only human, with all the fallability that entails.
I can agree with what your saying EXCEPT you leave no room for the fact that being a cop doesn't always make you right or a great person. Case in point: I got pulled over in a tourist town in florida for blowing a stop sign. It was obstructed by some bushes. The cop knew it was obstructed and instead of having someone cut back the bushes, he sat there and issued tickets for who knows how long. He issued so many tickets at that stop sign that eventually a judge caught on and my ticket was dropped. And let's not forget the harrisburg police who issued so many tickets on the 5 that they were eventually told not to set traps there anymore. Small town departments get revenue from stuff like that.
There are a lot of good cops out there, but how can you say that there aren't any bad ones? Remember the Eugene cop who was convicted of multiple counts of rape a few years back? I agree that most people who get tickets feel they were not at fault. In this case, the officer is notorious, so much so that you know who Andy is talking about already. Some cops sign on to actually help people, but a few are all about having power over other people........because nobody liked them in high school...
Like I said I can agree with you for the most part, but cops are only human, with all the fallability that entails.
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fishkiller
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xltom said:Broken Rod,
I can agree with what your saying EXCEPT you leave no room for the fact that being a cop doesn't always make you right or a great person. Case in point: I got pulled over in a tourist town in florida for blowing a stop sign. It was obstructed by some bushes. The cop knew it was obstructed and instead of having someone cut back the bushes, he sat there and issued tickets for who knows how long. He issued so many tickets at that stop sign that eventually a judge caught on and my ticket was dropped. And let's not forget the harrisburg police who issued so many tickets on the 5 that they were eventually told not to set traps there anymore. Small town departments get revenue from stuff like that.
There are a lot of good cops out there, but how can you say that there aren't any bad ones? Remember the Eugene cop who was convicted of multiple counts of rape a few years back? I agree that most people who get tickets feel they were not at fault. In this case, the officer is notorious, so much so that you know who Andy is talking about already. Some cops sign on to actually help people, but a few are all about having power over other people........because nobody liked them in high school...
It was actually Coburg. Harrisburg is no where close to I-5. Point being the cops left the bushes up to check for drunk drivers. 2 out 10 will be drunk. It's a law of averages.
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Thuggin4Life
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Yeah but if you get into an accident because obstructed signs you can sue the lan owner because of it. trust me my ann got hit over things like that. cut the bushes back cops are good to an extent but i don't go out of my way to be an ahole so niether should they.
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xltom
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Fishkiller,
In this case the cops were targeting people with out of state tags exclusively. If they were looking for drunks, he would have let me go with a warning when he saw I wasn't drunk. In any case(even if your right) that's dirty pool and we should expect better from the cops. Sobriety checkpoints are legal, so why use dirty tricks? If 2 out of 10 are drunks then 8 were harrased.....that's a lame law of averages: for every legitimate bust, 4 law abiding citizens get hassled. I bet it's more like 1 in 20 are drunk(I hope)... I used to live in Harrisburg by the way. It's not so far from the highway that a cop wouldn't go there to set speed traps. I believe you are correct about it being coburg cops though....It's been years since I lived up there.
In this case the cops were targeting people with out of state tags exclusively. If they were looking for drunks, he would have let me go with a warning when he saw I wasn't drunk. In any case(even if your right) that's dirty pool and we should expect better from the cops. Sobriety checkpoints are legal, so why use dirty tricks? If 2 out of 10 are drunks then 8 were harrased.....that's a lame law of averages: for every legitimate bust, 4 law abiding citizens get hassled. I bet it's more like 1 in 20 are drunk(I hope)... I used to live in Harrisburg by the way. It's not so far from the highway that a cop wouldn't go there to set speed traps. I believe you are correct about it being coburg cops though....It's been years since I lived up there.
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ShdwmnkyX
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There have been numerous times where cops have singled out and harrassed a single person who rubbed them the wrong way. (I should state not all, but some). I remember watching a video where a kid was being harrassed by an officer and he put a hidden camera in his dashboard. The next time he got pulled over the officer told him all he would have to do is say he found coke and the kid would go to prison. Needless to say he was let go.
Broken rod, I can see where as an officer you would take offense to someone saying the above. However wouldn't you agree that the incident that Thuggin is talking about furthers the divide between Police and the public? Wouldn't it perhaps be better to acknowledge the problem so it can be fixed and citizenry and peace officer can fix what has become a strained relationship over the last few decades?
Broken rod, I can see where as an officer you would take offense to someone saying the above. However wouldn't you agree that the incident that Thuggin is talking about furthers the divide between Police and the public? Wouldn't it perhaps be better to acknowledge the problem so it can be fixed and citizenry and peace officer can fix what has become a strained relationship over the last few decades?
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Thuggin4Life
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trust me mayhers a ************************.
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xltom
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Brokenrod said:I shouldn't say anything, but...
As a former law enforcement officer and a person that prides myself on being a law abiding citizen, like the majority of everyone else here, I have a hard time listening to people like you............And don't do it when I'm around either.
Please don't let your decision to work in the dirty side of public service make you jaded. Andy is good people. I bet you ran into a lot of low lifes at work, but that's the work you chose. You obviously believe greatly in the system of law we reside in but some of us put more faith in our own personal values and ethics. You got those attitudes from people because you were the guy that was sticking it to them. Comes with the territory. Nobody likes getting tickets. I hope in your time as a cop, some people were gratefull for the work you were doing as well.
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Brokenrod
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I agree that there are some bad apples, but why is it that you only remember that one bad one? That's because there are so few. I know that in other parts of the country there is a problem with corrupt officers, but it's not fair to generalize cops in the whole because of the few.
I can say this. Most people on the outside of the law system see certain things happen and don't understand why, but they can say that it looks wrong because they don't have the inside view of what is going on. It's natural to fear and ridicule what you don't understand. It's human nature. I can't tell you how many times I sat down with someone and had to explain why something had to happen a certain way, just to hear them say it didn't seem right.
Anyway, we don't have sobriety checks around here because it's BS to make everyone pay for the bad seeds. Also I know who the officer is because he has been running the same beat sense I was a young man and have dealt with him on at least a dozen occasions. He has a reputation for being a hard ass, but guess what? He's doing his job well and if I'm paying his wages, he better be. If he was persistent with our Thuggin buddy... well, chances are that either someone was disrespectful, just plain deserved it, or both.
I think my point is this. You do something wrong, fine. Man up and except it without making excuses and passing the blame off to someone else. Also, if you are still doing something wrong, don't make it public and expect to have any sympathy from anyone.
I can say this. Most people on the outside of the law system see certain things happen and don't understand why, but they can say that it looks wrong because they don't have the inside view of what is going on. It's natural to fear and ridicule what you don't understand. It's human nature. I can't tell you how many times I sat down with someone and had to explain why something had to happen a certain way, just to hear them say it didn't seem right.
Anyway, we don't have sobriety checks around here because it's BS to make everyone pay for the bad seeds. Also I know who the officer is because he has been running the same beat sense I was a young man and have dealt with him on at least a dozen occasions. He has a reputation for being a hard ass, but guess what? He's doing his job well and if I'm paying his wages, he better be. If he was persistent with our Thuggin buddy... well, chances are that either someone was disrespectful, just plain deserved it, or both.
I think my point is this. You do something wrong, fine. Man up and except it without making excuses and passing the blame off to someone else. Also, if you are still doing something wrong, don't make it public and expect to have any sympathy from anyone.
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SantiamDrifter
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xltom said:Please don't let your decision to work in the dirty side of public service make you jaded. Andy is good people. I bet you ran into a lot of low lifes at work, but that's the work you chose. You obviously believe greatly in the system of law we reside in but some of us put more faith in our own personal values and ethics. You got those attitudes from people because you were the guy that was sticking it to them. Comes with the territory. Nobody likes getting tickets. I hope in your time as a cop, some people were gratefull for the work you were doing as well. If not, that might be a reflection of your own job performance.
Before I get upset, care to explain what you mean by that?
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xltom
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Broken Rod,
I hear you buddy, and agree. Most police officers are good folks(said that already). You just said that it is a possibility that Andy got his ticket for being disrespectful. Sounds like abuse of authority to me. I believe the guy pulled Andy over more than twice that day before finally giving the ticket, and would have continued to pull him over until he found something....I respect a man for his actions, not the position he holds...
I hear you buddy, and agree. Most police officers are good folks(said that already). You just said that it is a possibility that Andy got his ticket for being disrespectful. Sounds like abuse of authority to me. I believe the guy pulled Andy over more than twice that day before finally giving the ticket, and would have continued to pull him over until he found something....I respect a man for his actions, not the position he holds...
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xltom
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Sorry Santiam, I just mean that cops sometimes deal with the dirty side of our community, not that policing is dirty business...I do believe we need police.
To all the cops on this forum: I know you guys work hard and believe in the work your doing. Thank you for your service. I also know you guys feel a lot of brotherhood for each other and have caught some flack here this week. Personally, I may have a problem with a particular law or an officer who did something I don't like. Please don't take it as an attack on you personally. By all means continue to give us your perspective. I will too.
To all the cops on this forum: I know you guys work hard and believe in the work your doing. Thank you for your service. I also know you guys feel a lot of brotherhood for each other and have caught some flack here this week. Personally, I may have a problem with a particular law or an officer who did something I don't like. Please don't take it as an attack on you personally. By all means continue to give us your perspective. I will too.
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ShdwmnkyX
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Santiam, I believe what xltom was trying to say that it is easy for a cop to become jaded and mistrustful of the common man due to the fact that Police officers see things that few others ever do or should have to, i.e. The dirty side of society. They get cussed out all day, and rarely deal wth some one who is just saying "Thanks for doing what you do." It does take its toll. Sorry xltom, I am not trying to put words in your mouth.
Polebender: I do not disagree with you about a few bad apples making everyone else look bad. I don't know Thuggin, from what I have seen here he seems like a nice guy and is always helpful. On the other hand I don't know the officer in question. I should also say that just because he treated you fairly doesn't mean he treats everyone fair.
I will say, before I go on that while not a law enforcement officer, I deal fairly closely with them. Many of my peers get into my field as a jumping point to law enforcement. The majority of the time I hear about excessive force I can hear the story and know that more often then not the person had it coming as I myself have been in those situations and know what it takes to get someone under control that doesn't want to be controlled.
That being said I should state that my point was that most officers take any comment about an officer personally. There are lots of good police, but they are all to willing to look the other way when another officer does something wrong because they don't want to be rats. There is also a troubling mentality among some police that its us against them (lol I guess I should be grateful that most consider me on the same team). In my verbose and pompous way, I'm just pointing out that there are two sides to a story and having a badge doesn't make a police officer's the right one.
Polebender: I do not disagree with you about a few bad apples making everyone else look bad. I don't know Thuggin, from what I have seen here he seems like a nice guy and is always helpful. On the other hand I don't know the officer in question. I should also say that just because he treated you fairly doesn't mean he treats everyone fair.
I will say, before I go on that while not a law enforcement officer, I deal fairly closely with them. Many of my peers get into my field as a jumping point to law enforcement. The majority of the time I hear about excessive force I can hear the story and know that more often then not the person had it coming as I myself have been in those situations and know what it takes to get someone under control that doesn't want to be controlled.
That being said I should state that my point was that most officers take any comment about an officer personally. There are lots of good police, but they are all to willing to look the other way when another officer does something wrong because they don't want to be rats. There is also a troubling mentality among some police that its us against them (lol I guess I should be grateful that most consider me on the same team). In my verbose and pompous way, I'm just pointing out that there are two sides to a story and having a badge doesn't make a police officer's the right one.
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xltom
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No prob Shdw,
You had me correct. And remember Officers, not everyone that breaks a law is evil. I think if you dig deep you might find that you have broken a law or two yourself. Most people have and in some cases it was the right thing to do: speeding to get to the hospital when your wife was in labor, getting in a fight with someone who was hitting his girl ect...We are all human and nobody is perfect..
You had me correct. And remember Officers, not everyone that breaks a law is evil. I think if you dig deep you might find that you have broken a law or two yourself. Most people have and in some cases it was the right thing to do: speeding to get to the hospital when your wife was in labor, getting in a fight with someone who was hitting his girl ect...We are all human and nobody is perfect..
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Brokenrod
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I have agree with what everyone has said for the most part and I don't (will never) claim that officers are perfect. The fact is if you ask any one of us if we have broken the law to some degree... well, the answer will be yes 99% of the time. We are human.
Am I jaded by my service? Yep, 110%. Don't get me started on excessive force, or turning a blind eye, or any other crap that the public is certain happens all the time. I could go on forever.
Let's go back to what has been said already though. Thuggin was doing something wrong and was busted for it. It sounds like he may have been given multiple warnings, or to be fair"harassed," before the ticket. My beef was that people don't have the testicular fortitude to admit to their wrong doings and I'm not just pointing the finger at Thuggin.
Someone said that there is two sides to every story. The fact is I don't think we have all the sides here and we are likely to be missing some key parts.
Oh yeah, the fact that Andy may be a super guy, I'm not saying he isn't, but he is breaking the law and flaunting it on an open forum. I have no problem with Andy as a person, or what he has done in the past, but what he is currently doing. Breaking the law.
Am I jaded by my service? Yep, 110%. Don't get me started on excessive force, or turning a blind eye, or any other crap that the public is certain happens all the time. I could go on forever.
Let's go back to what has been said already though. Thuggin was doing something wrong and was busted for it. It sounds like he may have been given multiple warnings, or to be fair"harassed," before the ticket. My beef was that people don't have the testicular fortitude to admit to their wrong doings and I'm not just pointing the finger at Thuggin.
Someone said that there is two sides to every story. The fact is I don't think we have all the sides here and we are likely to be missing some key parts.
Oh yeah, the fact that Andy may be a super guy, I'm not saying he isn't, but he is breaking the law and flaunting it on an open forum. I have no problem with Andy as a person, or what he has done in the past, but what he is currently doing. Breaking the law.
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bigsteel
Well-known member
geez i leave for an afternoon and you guys go crazy:lol::lol::lol: for the most part i like cops,,,but if they make a mistake they should man up and own it...
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xltom
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BR,
I can respect that perspective. I think the reason why he "flaunted" it is because he believes his suspension was unjust and even though he may "allegedly"(legal disclaimer..hehehe)have broken a law, he felt he was in the right. It's a bit of an abstract concept really. Is something morally wrong just because it is illegal? For example, not long ago interacial marriage was illegal. Or is everything that is legal, morally correct? I bet you officers still don't like when someone has a medical MJ card.....Sounds like I should save that one for my ethics class.....I would advise thuggin not to break the law, whether he was right or not, because I don't want to see him get into trouble...but not look down on him for something so small....
How about this: A guy is busted for failure to pay child support in full. He's paid for as much as he could, but is punished by having his driver's license suspended. Should he not drive to work the next day so his kids can get a bit of help, or should he be homeless and let the kids starve.......that law never made any sense to me.
I can respect that perspective. I think the reason why he "flaunted" it is because he believes his suspension was unjust and even though he may "allegedly"(legal disclaimer..hehehe)have broken a law, he felt he was in the right. It's a bit of an abstract concept really. Is something morally wrong just because it is illegal? For example, not long ago interacial marriage was illegal. Or is everything that is legal, morally correct? I bet you officers still don't like when someone has a medical MJ card.....Sounds like I should save that one for my ethics class.....I would advise thuggin not to break the law, whether he was right or not, because I don't want to see him get into trouble...but not look down on him for something so small....
How about this: A guy is busted for failure to pay child support in full. He's paid for as much as he could, but is punished by having his driver's license suspended. Should he not drive to work the next day so his kids can get a bit of help, or should he be homeless and let the kids starve.......that law never made any sense to me.
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Brokenrod
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The answer is... get a hardship license and keep his wing wang to himself so he doesn't have the same problem in the future. Just kidding, I don't have an answer to that one.
I don't think we need to go on with this one. It's the proverbial dead horse. We could go ahead and speculate about why things happen to the guy, but we have our opinions and he seems not willing to interject with what happened in its entirety.
I just want to leave one last thing. Police don't want to do something questionable, because when we sit down in front of the judge... we don't want to look like an idiot. We know doing the right thing will always be easier than something vindictive or screwed up.
Thuggin, get a pilot for your boat or start hitting the bank until the crap is over.
I don't think we need to go on with this one. It's the proverbial dead horse. We could go ahead and speculate about why things happen to the guy, but we have our opinions and he seems not willing to interject with what happened in its entirety.
I just want to leave one last thing. Police don't want to do something questionable, because when we sit down in front of the judge... we don't want to look like an idiot. We know doing the right thing will always be easier than something vindictive or screwed up.
Thuggin, get a pilot for your boat or start hitting the bank until the crap is over.
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xltom
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That's funny/true....Hahaha the guy I know who that happened to had 6 kids with 3 women. He was working hard(40hrs/week)...but was living in a school bus....You should have seen what they did to his paychecks. He had the worst teeth I've ever seen on a human being.... Don't know how he ever got 1 girl pregnant. The court should have ordered him to get 2 more jobs instead of taking his license.
Arguments and all, I thought this discussion turned out to be pretty interesting...maybe that's because I have been running my mouth so much..Sorry and thanks for giving the other side of the story BR
Arguments and all, I thought this discussion turned out to be pretty interesting...maybe that's because I have been running my mouth so much..Sorry and thanks for giving the other side of the story BR
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Brokenrod
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Good talkin to you.
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