Two Oregon bills propose restarting non-native summer run plants

[Growbug]

Check out Osprey Steelhead News for more details.

I KNOW for a fact that the local "Molalla River Alliance" and "Native Fish Society" are already against this and preparing legal papers to STOP the stocking of "Native Only Rivers" completely.

So? Thoughts? Restart Stocking or Leave Alone??

 

[Spydeyrch]

Wasn't there a thread on here just a little bit ago that linked to an article which stated it has been suggested that hatchery fish contribute to an overall decline of natural/wild fish. I think that the article primarily focused on steelies and salmon, if I remember correctly. Again, I could be wrong on that so.... take it with a grain of salt. But if it is true, then I would go against stocking it with hatcheries. Yet again, it does have it's pro of only allowing hatchery caught fish. Uuuummmmmm that is a tough one to decide on........

-Spydey

 

[Spydeyrch]

oooppppsss, sorry about the double post. system issues. my bad.

-spydey

 

[Bad Tuna]

Im all for it! Those two streams have late running natives that wont cross breed with hatchery summer steelhead. Both rivers have miles of under used water, if the summers were planted fairly low, there would be very little interaction. The molalla was stated as being a "native only" stream, but thats not true, there is a small planting of spring chinook in that stream as well. Both streams once had nice runs of hatchery summer steelhead, it would be nice to see them return.

Spydey, the same studies that show hatchery/native cross breeding as bad, are not being refuted by studies that show native fish RARELY spawn withg hatchery fish, and that hatchery fish spawning in the wild become just as viable in spawning success in only a few generations. Again, isolate the release site from the winter steelheads spawning grounds and there should be no problems at all.

 

[Irishrover]

Senator Girod introduced the legislation. The one SJM 16 is nothing more than the a request asking the Federal government to put summers in the Molalla. It has no real effect and it has to pass out of the Senate. From SJM 16 "Urges Congress, United States Secretary of Commerce and United
States Secretary of the Interior to support initiatives to reintroduce hatchery summer run steelhead into Molalla River."


The other SB 643 is sitting in the Environment and Natural Resources Committe. It is chaired by Senator Jackie Dingfelder. Fat chance she will even let it get to a hearing let alone come to the floor for a vote. Remember last session Senator Girod introduced legislation to ban gill netting on the Columbia River. It died in Dingfelders committe, no hearing no vote. A lot of the times senators introduce legislation they know won't make it though the system but they do it to appease some of their constituents.

Just my opinion but I don't think there will be any changes to either river as a result of this proposed legislation.

 

[bigsteel]

I say leave them alone to the natives,,if they want a meat fishery put it in the highest populated metro area where the majority of anglers want to harvest a fish.

 

[Bad Tuna]

The Molalla is very close to Portland, and the little north fork Santiam is very close to Salem, both have high population densities, and both rivers recieve strays in fair numbers.

 

[JeannaJigs]

Terrible idea.

Look at the McKenzie...over-ran with introduced steelhead and the trout are getting screwed.

 

[bigsteel]

The Molalla is very close to Portland, and the little north fork Santiam is very close to Salem, both have high population densities, and both rivers recieve strays in fair numbers.

ummm the little north santiam is in lyons and the population is around 1400,i have fished that river since i was a a kid and it is not in a populated area....im talking like the clackamas around portland.

 

[bigsteel]

Terrible idea.

Look at the McKenzie...over-ran with introduced steelhead and the trout are getting screwed.

yes they are,everyone always focuses on steelhead or salmon,,WHAT ABOUT THE TROUT?

 

[lilsalmon]

yes they are,everyone always focuses on steelhead or salmon,,WHAT ABOUT THE TROUT?

What he said.....

 

[Bad Tuna]

I haven't fished the McKenzie for trout for a few years, but everytime we fish for steelhead or salmon we catch tons of trout. Usually steelhead/salmon are beneficial to trout. What has happened to the trout population there? Seems as strong as ever to me, but I only fish it 2-3 times a year.

 

[brandon4455]

What he said.....

agreed. trout are important too you know.

 

[bigsteel]

I haven't fished the McKenzie for trout for a few years, but everytime we fish for steelhead or salmon we catch tons of trout. Usually steelhead/salmon are beneficial to trout. What has happened to the trout population there? Seems as strong as ever to me, but I only fish it 2-3 times a year.

the wild fish population has been going down for years,they stock the hell out of the upper portion of the river with hot dog sized trout and the lower river they stock tons of steelhead,,,theres only so much habitat and food for the fish.......

 

[Growbug]

agreed. trout are important too you know.

Especially if you look at baby Steelies as 'trout'.

One of the problems with the Molalla idea is that the "planted" rainbows / steelies have to run the gauntlet of Large/Smallmouth Bass in the lower sections and will also have to compete with the native cutthroat in the higher sections.

 

[troutramp]

I kinda lean toward leaving it to the nates, what little background in biology I have tells me that it a river does not have a summer run and/or never did, it may not be "built" to suppport it? I have heard the stories about the mo during the "planted" years.

 

[Growbug]

I have heard the stories about the mo during the "planted" years.

yah.... complete 3 ring circus with nets, and everything.

The Molalla is just about to get a designation as "wild and scenic". If you have ever been up there during the summer months, then you will agree with the "wild" but "scenic"??? There are times when i have taken full trash bags of cans, bottles, paper, etc out of the fishing hole BEFORE i can fish it...

Start putting planters back in and publicizing the events, you are going to get a LOAD more people, a LOAD more trash, and a LOAD more problems..

The best way to improve this river is not to stock it with inferior genes but to remove the REAL problem... the NON NATIVE BASS!!!

 

[troutramp]

I bet those bass wreak havock on the steelie smolts. maybe they could put a bounty on them? I would be down for that plus i could always use the cash.

 

[Bad Tuna]

yah.... complete 3 ring circus with nets, and everything.

The Molalla is just about to get a designation as "wild and scenic". If you have ever been up there during the summer months, then you will agree with the "wild" but "scenic"??? There are times when i have taken full trash bags of cans, bottles, paper, etc out of the fishing hole BEFORE i can fish it...

Start putting planters back in and publicizing the events, you are going to get a LOAD more people, a LOAD more trash, and a LOAD more problems..

The best way to improve this river is not to stock it with inferior genes but to remove the REAL problem... the NON NATIVE BASS!!!

Most of those people leaving the trash wernt fishing. Most are kids, many from Woodburn drinking and partying. As I stated earlier, if the hatchery plantings were lower in the system, like near the golf course, there would be very little contact between summer and winter steelhead. I think the point of the bills were to provide angler opportunity, not improve the river to "wild and scenic" status. Steelhead or not, the kids will still party, youll still pick up all the budlight cans along side the road, and "those with beards" will still be putting nets out. The "inferior genes" only comes into play if the fish interbreed, but that is not likely to happen according to the latest studies, and run timing/placement.

 

[Growbug]

I agree totally where the trash comes from.. it gets warm and the families go camping, or day tripping. The 'family sites' are actually a lot worse than the areas where the 'kids are partying'. Kids dont leave diapers, etc behind, and the cigarette ends end up in the fire ring.

Fisherman?? Well, the 'fishermen' follow the fish. If there are more 'fin clipped' then there will be more fishermen. Since there isn't that much public access along the river, then they will probably be focused on certain areas. That being said, this river has a LOT of length where people can't get to it other by boat or trespass. There will be areas where the fish are 'safe'.
People don't just fish the Mo as catch n release. I have heard rumblings around here that there are more than a few people who keep the ones with fins (out of special season). I dont believe such 'sportsmen' will be seen on sites like this much though. Plus, there have been more than a few fish turning up this year that arent wearing that special fin (strays from local 'hatcheries' that got lost). Another plus... the regs clearly state that a person can keep a fish with a fin (Salmon and Steelies) through a nice portion of the year. This suggests that there is already a run (during those times) that can sustain such a harvest.

My thoughts are still that there should be rivers that remain closed to stocking, just so that the native species in that river have a chance to survive all on their own.