Harvesting Steelhead in ABC...

[bran_man]

Ok so I know there have already been posts about this topic, but I just wanted to clarify. You absolutely DO need a combined angling tag in order to harvest/ keep steelhead out of Alton Baker Canal!!!! I have talked/ minor argued over this with quite a few different anglers over this topic out there. the response I get the most from "those guys" is that you do not need to tag them because it is a stocking location and that they are planted there... My response is, "So what!?" what does that have anything to do with it? Even if they may be planted there at times, Steelhead also get there on their own as well and ALL require tagging regardless. Here is the evidence to needing a tag for all of you non- believers out there: Almost ALWAYS (being very generic for obvious reasons) are steelhead/salmon only ever considered "trout" in a lake/pond or some other LANDLOCK situation (A.B.C. of course being a connecting tributary to the willamette... it's like 200 freaking feet away) Also when special regs of retention of steelhead as trout occurs, it will be clearly stated in specifics under each special zone. Alton does not state anywhere in the section about this (also when nothing is stated like this, it just generally implies the need of a tag) Also, when looking at the tag number index, alton baker canal has it's own tag number! ( I believe it's 187...?) Why would it have a tag number if you don't need to tag them? You of course don't have to believe me, but the last person I told this to who I watched catch a beautiful hen, who didn't have a tag, an hour later also watched him receive a $300 fine. that is waaaaaaay more expensive than just going to the store and buying the angling tag!!!! Serves those type of people right! I apologize for the lecture! It's just that I really love/ enjoy fishing, but I also take it very seriously and I don't like it when people don't follow even the simplest of regs. thanks for all of your time!

 

[everett464]

I didn't realize it was so controversial a topic, but yes, you are right: you do need a tag.

 

[fredaevans]

To my knowledge, the only place in Oregon you might fish WITHOUT the proper lic., and or tags, would be on Private impoundments (Pay to Play).

 

[the_intimidator03]

actually fredaevans, Crater Lake is no lic required... i know it applies to the lake i dunno about the entire national park...

As for the original Post at hand. You can only try and teach someone the easy way. some of them just going to learn the hard way... thankfully there is that tip it number for help and just because there is a "dam" of any sort doesn't mean a body of water is landlocked. Always refer to general zone regulations then special regulations for the system/area you are fishing... then double and triple check then pray you didn't misread it 3 times and understand it :-D

 

[troutdude]

You are quite right about everything that you said bran man. While it is not stated on pg. 49 in the reg book, that you need a tag...here is a direct quote from ODFW's Weekly Recreation Report:

ALTON BAKER CANOE CANAL: trout

Alton Baker Canoe Canal was recently stocked with 2,000 rainbow trout. This water body is located in downtown Eugene behind Autzen Stadium. A 4-acre pond at the midpoint of the canal is a good spot but it can be fished all along its 2-mile length from Day Island Road in Eugene to Aspen Street in Springfield. Summer steelhead are occasionally caught in this system and anglers are reminded they will need a combined angling tag to legally harvest a steelhead. It is legal to fish with two rods in the Alton Baker Canoe Canal, provided the appropriate licenses have been purchased.

ABC gets occasional nates too; as they are able to venture out of the Willy and into the canal. It would be doubly illegal to keep a native steelie that are not over 24" as well. Nates under 24" must be released.

Some people are just stupid beyond reason. Or, they just don't care about following the rules. So, I have to laugh at the moron who kept an untagged steelie, that cost them 300 bucks! And it's especially funny, because you TOLD them not to keep it / or to get a tag first! LOL

However, here is something that just occurred to me: neither the Zone Regulations nor the Special Regulations state that an ABC steelie needs to be tagged. If I got a ticket/fine under those circumstances, I would definitely point it out to the judge and try to get my ticket/fine overturned. In other words, I'm suggesting that ODFW add a comment under Special Reg's, that a Tag is needed to keep steelies in ABC.

 

[fredaevans]

Interesting: "actually fredaevans, Crater Lake is no lic required... i know it applies to the lake i dunno about the entire national park..." Another (in one thread no less) "I'll be darned." Never heard of folks actualy hiking down into the crater to fish. No idea the thing was even stocked. But the norm would be (National Park) you'd need some sort of license to fish. Will have to Google the Park and see if there's special 'in park' regs you can review.

Interesting to compare Montana's regulations vs those of Yellowstone Park. Fish there (the Park) you'd better have them in hand or you could get in 'do-do' darned quick!

fae

 

[the_intimidator03]

as a matter of fact crater lake has rainbow and kokanee trout. If you look in the Southeast Section of the regulations, Under special regulations it list Crater Lake National Park and states this:
Angling in Crater Lake National Park is regulated by the National Park Service
For Additional Information call (541)594-3000

You are allowed to fish from wizard island and the beach at the boat dock. AND to top it all off... here is a link for the information you need from National Park Service. Fish and Fishing at Crater Lake National Park

It also goes into the history of how fish came to be in crater lake

 

[troutdude]

Hey folks, this thread is about Alton Baker Canal, and the regulations for it...not for Crater Lake. If you'd like to talk about Crater Lake, then by all means please start a NEW thread. But, this one is about ABC. Thank you.

 

[fredaevans]

Hummmm. Interesting thought ... perhaps?

Hummmm. Interesting thought ... perhaps?

Hey folks, this thread is about Alton Baker Canal, and the regulations for it...not for Crater Lake. If you'd like to talk about Crater Lake, then by all means please start a NEW thread. But, this one is about ABC. Thank you.

I took the initial post to be centered on where you could 'fish' with out a proper fishing license in your pocket. "ABC" was an example of where 'confusion' may well come into play. Might there be others?

There's an 'old saying,' you might have heard of it: "To be forewarned, is to be forearmed." Another reference was made to a '$300.00 ticket,' I've seen a few passed out.

One was to a 70++ year old Gentleman from New York State because he caught/kept a 8" cutthroat trout here on the upper Rogue. (I was there when it was handed out.)

Old fellow was ecstatic that he'd caught something ... have a clue it was a cutthroat? Clueless. The OSP officer was less than 'enthusiastic.'

End game was I paid for the Atty to defend him in Court. I have to paraphrase here as this was years ago, but the last 'exchange' between 'my' Attny and the Judge went something like this.

Judge: 'It is the responsibility of the fisherman to read and understand the published regulations.'

Atty: 'Your Honor, have you ever actually looked at the regulations as presently published?'

Judge: 'No I haven't.'

Atty: "Your Honor, I am a Atty at Law licensed in several States, I fish in many of them. I have no clue what the hell they're talking about half the time. I would expect a very senior citizen to understand less.'

Fine was $1.00 and 'Court Costs,' case dismissed. The above cost me several hundred dollars, but worth every penny.

Something to think about. Perhaps, or perhaps not.

Fred

 

[everett464]

And now you have made it a thread about Lawyers!!! We are going to need a moderator to keep this thread on track!!!

Seriously though, that is a cool story. What prompted you to pay for the attorney? Did you know the guy? I have had days, on more than one occasion, where I couldn't figure out exactly what the rule was, and so I just said to heck with it, and went with my best interpretation.

 

[fredaevans]

And now you have made it a thread about Lawyers!!! We are going to need a moderator to keep this thread on track!!!

Seriously though, that is a cool story. What prompted you to pay for the attorney? Did you know the guy? I have had days, on more than one occasion, where I couldn't figure out exactly what the rule was, and so I just said to heck with it, and went with my best interpretation.

Have I now?

But to answer your second question:

After, not before.

"As a Man, there are times you must stand up and be counted, regardless of the cost."

No disrespect intended, but that's one of lifes lessons on the road to becoming a 'Man.'

fae

 

[everett464]

Uhhh... no, you have not. I was making light of a prior expressed sentiment I thought unwarranted. I thought your story was cool, and I personally have issues with the direction this thread has taken.

Good on you for helping a fellow fisherman out.

 

[TroutSlayer]

I personally asked this question to OSP while getting my license checked at Alton baker and JC pond and both cases said yes a tag is required to keep steelhead regardless of location or planted I was specially interested in JC pond and you do have to have a tag to keep planted steelhead out of the pond. Hope this ends disputes I didn't have time to read all the posts

 

[crusty old fisherman]

as far as I know ODFW plants steelhead smolts in the altonbaker pools they acclimate there then flush out ito the river and migrate to the ocean. I also heard that ODFW was going away from planting rainbow smolts in the river and switched over to planting steelhead smolts same cost to raise but a much bigger benifit in the end if any of them survive and migrate down river. I am not sure if either is true but at least thats what I have heard around

 

[Fisher.King]

I didn't realize it was so controversial a topic, but yes, you are right: you do need a tag.

Steelhead under a certain length are considered trout though, I thought. What's the length a trout is considered a steelhead at?

Exact quote from the regs:

Open for trout and adipose fin-clipped steelhead entire year.
Open to harvest of non-adipose fin-clipped steelhead greater than 24 inches entire year.

So natives over 24 inches, and clipped steelhead from whatever the starting length is to 24 inches?

 

[the_intimidator03]

in rivers and streams Rainbow trout over 20 inches are considered steelhead. If I do recall correctly I think down on the rogue it may even go down to 16" or so and over.

 

[troutdude]

Steelhead under a certain length are considered trout though, I thought. What's the length a trout is considered a steelhead at?

Exact quote from the regs:

Open for trout and adipose fin-clipped steelhead entire year.
Open to harvest of non-adipose fin-clipped steelhead greater than 24 inches entire year.

So natives over 24 inches, and clipped steelhead from whatever the starting length is to 24 inches?

Here is how I interpret the regs for ABC:

Yes, natives (with fin) can be harvested...BUT, must be tagged as a steelhead. Do you have a Salmon / Steelhead tag? If not, you will need to buy one (if you want to target and / or keep a fish like that). ABC is also open to harvesting ANY trout / steelhead that is a hatchery fish (fin-clipped).

Does anyone else have any comments? A question that I know have is...does a hatchery steelie need to be tagged if caught at ABC?

 

[Fisher.King]

Yes I knew about the tags and have them. There was a topic on this awhile ago. I caught a fish that would be classified as a steelhead if the cops asked up near the I-5 bridge in the canal and raged since I didn't have my tags. It was my first steelhead ever that I hooked and landed with no help but I hadn't bought this years tags yet... This is the 3rd year I've bought tags and not filled any slots . My first keeper is out there right now though, somewhere... He's only about 2 inches long right now though, with my luck XD.

 

[fredaevans]

Great thread.

Great thread.

As it points up that you'd better be up on the Reg's BEFORE you go fishing 'someplace.' Different Fora, but a fellow from Nor-Cal wanted to come up and fish the North Umpqua 'fly only' water and posted a question as to whether 'tube flies' (done on metal bodies) would be 'legal.'

One of the Fora Folks pulled the 2011 Oregon Regs and typed in the definition of 'what is a fly.' Only problem .... the standard doesn't apply on the NU (or at least in the fly only water). Fellow did say in his post that he wasn't sure and recommended the initial poster 'not push it.'

Saw the exchange yesterday and did a OH MY GOD! Noooooooo, Nooooooo and Noooooo :naughty:in that strip of water. Don't know if that "Special Regulation" (what's a legal fly construction) is totally unique to that bit of water, but it really is 'unique.' ray:

One wonders who writes the stuff that goes into the fishing reg's books. Heading over to Montana in a couple of weeks for a stay with my 'ex,' yes we get along very well. Anyway she's a two minute walk from the Bitterroot river. Had her send me a copy of the current fishing regulations ...... if I've got the 'scale' right, the reg's change SEVEN TIMES over the course of 20'ish miles of river.

Tad more 'research' yesterday (local news paper on line is a good thing) and even the locals are clueless as to where some of these things change from place to place.

Who dreams all this stuff up ... and maybe more importantly .... why?

 

[Fisher.King]

Who dreams all this stuff up ... and maybe more importantly .... why?

Well some regulations are agreeable, but most of them are like this. Especially in large rivers, the Willamette river is split into like 10 different subsections. Very confusing when traveling to new places :think: